VM farming

[100kgs]

On March 13, 2026, about a week ago, player mamekyo @mamekyo posted a video to the videos channel in discord, showcasing themselves farming Count D raid (the latest official content available on CC) but with a twist. They had the game client opened normally but also had 3 VMware windows logged in at the same time, all on alt accounts, and 'leeching' off the main account, effectively getting 4x drop rates compared to a regular player farming this content. User Erlenesia (@sethkuroneko) called them out today and claimed that everyone should also do the same and crash the market if it's not against the rules. I'm sure that staff has already been made aware of this video, but I wanted to make this post anyway so community members could offer their opinions.

As some of you may already know, this has been going on for years now, mamekyo is far from the first person to do it. It became a thing ever since spamming a dungeon for red drops was profitable, I don't have screenshot proof with me right now but you would see parties of 1 very strong main character + 3 random alts farming these raids or bosses, the alts sometimes equipped with extra FIB gear/costumes and/or consumables to further boost rates. Even if you didn't have a strong enough character to do high-end content, there were players just using 4 characters in the same party to farm various other dungeons, increasing efficiency and providing a big advantage while still complying with the community guidelines.

One of the root problems is CC allowing players to multiaccount at all in the first place. I know it's not really the same as running VMs and farming multiple accounts at once, but I feel the need to briefly bring it up anyway. Multiaccounting in this game is insanely profitable, even more so since +30 enhancement cap was introduced. As a somewhat endgame player myself, I estimate that at least 90% of top rankers have at some point made use of alt accounts be it for themselves or trading (purchasing/selling some form of enhancement or tuning service) with someone who has mega resources just from running a 30 second event dungeon weekly on a bunch of their alt accounts. The market is flooded with players providing such services and for good reason. There's also other old posts such as this complaining about it but it's pretty clear at this point staff is just planning to maintain status quo.

Just a discussion post. Interested to hear what others think, but I don't really expect anything to happen

[Kew]

I don't think the forum is frequently used by many players but I will voice my thoughts on this matter. 

Well, I have no problem with "multi-accounting" tbh.

If someone wants to make 5 accounts and spend all day manually grinding dailies on each one, honestly? Go for it. That’s their time and their effort. But multi-clienting (opening 3-4 game windows at once via VMs) is a different beast. You’re doing the work of one person but getting 4x the rewards. That’s not "working harder," it’s just breaking the game’s intended loop

The "If they can, I should too" mentality is the biggest issue for the community. When people see others getting massive stacks of loot by leeching off their own alts, it kills the motivation to play normally. No one will be looking for spam party, they're just gonna turn on VMs and do it with their alt accounts instead. And people without the strong pc to run multiple VMs? They could just sit there and wait for someone to sell the mods since it has become a 'common' drop now. Red mods should be a "lucky find," not something you're guaranteed to get because you have a beefy PC that can run four clients at once.

Finally, if everyone starts doing this, the economy is doomge

Too many drops = everyone starts lowballing to sell fast

The market crashes, and suddenly the stuff you spent hours farming is worth nothing.

Multi-accounting is a choice of how you spend your time. Multi-clienting is a shortcut that messes with the balance for everyone else

[mamekyo]

Since you tagged me, I’ll share my perspective.

From my understanding of the current rules, I believe using VMware is not explicitly prohibited.

Why I consider VMware to be acceptable:

1. VMware is simply an environment that allows programs to run. In practice, it is comparable to using multiple physical machines rather than modifying the game client or using automation tools. Its function is to replicate separate systems, not to alter gameplay mechanics.

2. I do not consider running four accounts in Count D raids to provide a fundamental advantage over a standard 4-player party.

A single run, including loading time, already takes at least eight minutes or more. In addition, to avoid losing revival resources, you still need to actively manage revive timing, which requires constant attention. For me, this is not something that can be done passively or AFK. Given the effort involved versus the rewards, I consider it a reasonable trade-off, which is why I choose to farm it.

3. If we are discussing potential advantages more broadly, tools that improve network performance (such as ExitLag) can have a noticeable impact on damage output and overall performance. By that logic, one could also argue they provide an advantage. This raises the question of where the line should be drawn—whether such tools are considered acceptable while VM usage is not.

From my perspective, running multiple accounts on multiple machines is not fundamentally different from running them through virtual machines. If the concern is about game balance, then multi-account usage itself is the core issue, rather than the specific method used (VM vs. multiple PCs). In fact, acquiring multiple capable physical machines can be comparable in cost or even cheaper than setting up one machine to run the game alongside multiple virtual instances.

Ultimately, I am not sure how the CC staff officially interprets this situation. Based on my own reading of the current rules, I do not believe this constitutes a violation.

However, if the staff determines that this behavior is against the rules and issues penalties, I will accept that decision, as it is a private server and enforcement is ultimately at the discretion of the administrators.

For others, I believe reporting through proper channels is sufficient. I don’t think attempting to influence opinions in Discord channels is necessary.


 

Finally, regarding my view on the rules: I believe that in this game, prohibiting multi-accounting is the most reasonable approach, as it is also the easiest way to determine a violation, leaving no gray areas whatsoever.

(The above was translated by ChatGPT, so some expressions may not be perfectly accurate, but I believe it conveys my intended meaning.)

Edited March 19 by mamekyo

[Soma]

I just want to point out that the the majority of what mamekyo kinda covers the basis of everything. Summed up:

1. Where do you draw the line as you could easily have several machines running the game client or you could have rented servers running seporate game clients and the result would be the same / similar. Theres also the situation where you could have some friends log in the accounts and sit there while you do the dungeon and claim all the rewards from them. 

2. You have more chance to get the item which is true. But you are bringing 3 dead weights with you that as stated by mamekyo have to be actively revived and pressed to load the next map or enter the dungeon.

 

The way I see it is that the video shows that the person isn't using tools to enhance the gameplay like a bot and is actively playing the game. Maybe there needs to be an evaluation of where in situations this could be heavily abused and maybe adjustments made there but for the level of extra effort and the energy costs of running your computer at full throttle to be able to run 4 clients at the same time some could argue how much advantage does this really give.

[Xelenia]

I agree with what Kew said earlier. For me, the main issue here is not multi accounting itself, but the fact that this setup feels like it is bypassing the intended limitations of the system.

The game client seems to be designed in a way that naturally limits how many accounts a player can realistically run at the same time on one device. Using virtual machines to run multiple clients may require extra effort, but it still allows one player to generate rewards at a rate the game was probably not balanced around.

Even if this does not fall under botting or cheating with the current wording of the rules, it can still have a noticeable impact on the economy and overall balance of the server. When one player can effectively produce the drops of several players at once, supply increases much faster than intended, which can reduce item value and affect motivation for others to play normally.

So my concern is less about whether this is technically allowed, and more about whether this goes against the intended design of the game.

Of course, if this ends up being considered acceptable, then I guess the logical conclusion is that more people will start doing the same thing. And if that happens, I can’t really blame anyone for following what the rules currently allow, even if the long term result might not be very healthy for the server economy.

That’s why I think it would be better to clarify the stance on this sooner rather than later, before it becomes the new normal.

[Chiharu]

Since I was asked for my take on the matter, I'm just going to make this short since no one's going to read what I have to say anyways, ok?

It's all about the intent behind the use of the program. This is also why I'm glad that botting is against the rules. You have to remember the community that we have on C:C. These people will take advantage of shit and overprice shit. If it's not the obvious reasons as to why most people don't play anymore, it's also because of how people treat people in the community, specifically the economy. That's why you see a few people here trying to bring awareness to the economy. People also play this game because of the economy. As you can see, we currently have high prices for even the smallest of things. That's why it's getting bought up. I'm against it. But at least now I will know in advance as to why prices suddenly change. I'm not pointing fingers, I'm just going to take this information, access it, analyze, and make adjustments as per usual. Thank you Seia for the information. 

Mame, do you, I guess. This is your issue, not mine. You wanna continue to do it, by all means. I have no issue, I'm just going to be doing my own thing. Anyone else wanna try it, by all means, if it somehow gets put on the rules as a bannable offense, that's your issue, not ours. If this becomes an issue for the economy, well, we'll know how it got even worse. That is all.

Edited March 19 by Chiharu

[hardlife]

VPN/exitlag user here, i use it only to stabilize the connection not to gain extra rewards or bypass game limits
even after paying extra for this service i still can't match the ping of players who live closer to the server so its not actualy an advantage, just make the game playable 
Its completly different from using VM to run multiple accounts which directly multiplies rewards, the game itself doesn't even allow multiple clients at once which is why people resort to VMs or multiple PCs so its already going against the intended design

On top of that VPN/exitlag has zero impact to other players while VMs does
imagine this if everyone use VPN nothing breaks but if everyone used VM farming it surely would break economy

[mamekyo]

CC officials have taken notice of this post and have seen my video, and I am still able to log in. So there’s actually not much more I need to say. At the very least, the CC team was not able to determine right away that I violated any rules.

Since I have not been penalized, I hope that those of you who have concerns can focus on whether the game rules should be revised regarding this matter, rather than framing it as “this bad actor is violating the rules, damaging the market, and should be banned.”

That said, I still want to add this: I believe that if NADDIC truly wanted to prevent this game from running in a virtual machine, they absolutely have the capability to implement basic protections, and it would not be too difficult.

For example, in MapleStory, one of my favorite games, it detects whether it is running in a virtual environment and refuses to launch if it is. If you want to run it in a virtual machine, you would have to modify the VM’s virtual hardware information. To me, that is what crossing the line looks like, and what counts as bypassing the intended game design to run the game. (Although even then, it still wouldn’t necessarily get you banned.)

In that case, I would instead use multiple physical PCs combined with remote access software to achieve multi-client play in MapleStory. (Unfortunately, I happen to have a lot of spare computers at my family home.) If the same approach were applied to CC, would those who have objections to VMs also consider this to be against the rules? After all, I could use remote software to control four CC clients from a single machine. Would remote access tools then also need to be banned?

Anyway, what I’m trying to say is that those who are still focusing on whether VMware violates the rules make me suspect that the real intention is simply to get rid of me.


 

As for whether I will keep farming, honestly this has been the most exhausting farming experience I’ve ever had. I originally planned to stop after a week, since I was mainly doing it for the dopamine from red drops, and I’ve already become somewhat desensitized to it.

I don’t really care about the profit either. Farming more than 8 hours a day for 7 days still earns less than a single 8-hour workday for me.

It sounds like there’s no real reason for me to keep doing it. However, since some people think that I alone can affect the market, I may continue farming for a few hours each day until CC makes adjustments or a more enjoyable game comes along.

Edited March 19 by mamekyo

[KyyXD]

I don't care if you want to play with 10/20 accounts at once using this VM. The problem is that you're selling drop items at ridiculously low prices and still offering discounts, which is disgusting. Many people spam raids to collect credits from drops obtained at normal prices, and you're actually lowering the prices. This isn't meant to put you down, but rather an ethical issue. What's wrong with selling drop items at normal prices? Are you afraid they won't sell? Don't you know how hard it is to get even one drop the normal way? If you sold drop items at normal prices, this wouldn't happen.

Edited March 19 by KyyXD

[mamekyo]

3 hours ago, KyyXD said:

I don't care if you want to play with 10/20 accounts at once using this VM. The problem is that you're selling drop items at ridiculously low prices and still offering discounts, which is disgusting. Many people spam raids to collect credits from drops obtained at normal prices, and you're actually lowering the prices. This isn't meant to put you down, but rather an ethical issue. What's wrong with selling drop items at normal prices? Are you afraid they won't sell? Don't you know how hard it is to get even one drop the normal way? If you sold drop items at normal prices, this wouldn't happen.

This isn’t an ethical issue, it’s just the market not aligning with your expectations. What you call a “normal price” is simply your own definition.

[Kew]

Tbh, the whole "people are just trying to get rid of me" argument is a reach. Nobody is losing sleep over one specific player, we all have our own lives. The issue isn't who is doing it, it’s what it does to the game we all enjoy. 

If the staff keeps allowing VM farming, this game stops being entertainment and just becomes a "factory." Where’s the fairness in that? If the meta becomes "whoever can run the most background windows wins," the spirit of the game is dead

The economy in a MMO game is essential. A functional economy creates a ecosystem where everyone needs each other:

The farmers: They farm the materials that whales are too busy/lazy to farm

The whales: They buy those materials, giving the farmers the credits they need to upgrade their own gear

If someone can just run 4 accounts on a VM and farm all their own materials plus a surplus to sell, they stop interacting with the rest of the community. The "bridge" between new players and veterans snaps, veterans find no motivation to grind CDH as for the value isn't worth their effort and time.

The mid-tier players (around 250-350m TCP) are already in a tough spot. LBR is hardcore and the FPS drops on certain bosses make it a nightmare to grind. For these players, content like CDH is supposed to be the sweet spot. It’s where newbies and veterans can actually play together, grind for mats, and hope for that lucky red drops to fund their progression

CDH spam party should be a win-win:

- Newbies get mats to transcend their epic mods and potentially huge funds from a lucky drop.
- Veterans help out while having the potential to make funds as well.

But when people use VMs to 4-man "leech" the drops, they aren't helping anyone. They’re just inflating the market. Sure, it might make some items cheaper for returnees/newbies in the short term, but it kills the motivation to actually play. Why bother grinding for a week when someone else just "factored" the 'rare loot' in a day?

We couldn't care less about a certain player, people come and go. We care about the fact that this "industrial" style of farming makes the effort of every regular player feel worthless.

Consider this my final contribution to the discussion. A game should be a world, not a factory. It was really nice to read different aspects on this matter

[Chiharu]

8 hours ago, mamekyo said:

CC officials have taken notice of this post and have seen my video, and I am still able to log in. So there’s actually not much more I need to say. At the very least, the CC team was not able to determine right away that I violated any rules.

Since I have not been penalized, I hope that those of you who have concerns can focus on whether the game rules should be revised regarding this matter, rather than framing it as “this bad actor is violating the rules, damaging the market, and should be banned.”

That said, I still want to add this: I believe that if NADDIC truly wanted to prevent this game from running in a virtual machine, they absolutely have the capability to implement basic protections, and it would not be too difficult.

For example, in MapleStory, one of my favorite games, it detects whether it is running in a virtual environment and refuses to launch if it is. If you want to run it in a virtual machine, you would have to modify the VM’s virtual hardware information. To me, that is what crossing the line looks like, and what counts as bypassing the intended game design to run the game. (Although even then, it still wouldn’t necessarily get you banned.)

In that case, I would instead use multiple physical PCs combined with remote access software to achieve multi-client play in MapleStory. (Unfortunately, I happen to have a lot of spare computers at my family home.) If the same approach were applied to CC, would those who have objections to VMs also consider this to be against the rules? After all, I could use remote software to control four CC clients from a single machine. Would remote access tools then also need to be banned?

Anyway, what I’m trying to say is that those who are still focusing on whether VMware violates the rules make me suspect that the real intention is simply to get rid of me.


 

As for whether I will keep farming, honestly this has been the most exhausting farming experience I’ve ever had. I originally planned to stop after a week, since I was mainly doing it for the dopamine from red drops, and I’ve already become somewhat desensitized to it.

I don’t really care about the profit either. Farming more than 8 hours a day for 7 days still earns less than a single 8-hour workday for me.

It sounds like there’s no real reason for me to keep doing it. However, since some people think that I alone can affect the market, I may continue farming for a few hours each day until CC makes adjustments or a more enjoyable game comes along.

I understand that you feel offended and think that we're trying to get rid of you, but for the most part, we're trying to tell you what doing some shit like this would potentially and/or eventually do to our economy once others figure out that you're basically getting a pass for using it since Soma basically said that there's no evidence of you using any malicious programs. I think you're missing the whole point of what we're trying to say because you feel attacked. 

We just don't want shit to get worse because we know the community that we play in. We know that you don't care. We're just saying that if others try it too and considering that they have a track record of finding loopholes through changes because some of these people to this day still participate in RMT and still fuck up prices or take advantage of prices. If they find out that they're allowed to use the program that you use too in order to increase their chances of dropping shit and fucking up the prices even more, then the economy is even more cooked. THAT'S what we're trying to say. I don't know if you're new to C:C or not, but this have been the problem that we've been dealing with and fighting for years.

 

[mamekyo]

4 hours ago, Kew said:

Tbh, the whole "people are just trying to get rid of me" argument is a reach. Nobody is losing sleep over one specific player, we all have our own lives. The issue isn't who is doing it, it’s what it does to the game we all enjoy. 

If this isn’t about targeting an individual, then please keep the discussion focused on whether this is compliant with the rules and whether the rules themselves should be adjusted.

Instead of attacking me on Discord and trying to steer public opinion by labeling me as morally flawed—just because I don’t play the game the way you think it should be played.

 

4 hours ago, Kew said:

If the staff keeps allowing VM farming, this game stops being entertainment and just becomes a "factory." Where’s the fairness in that? If the meta becomes "whoever can run the most background windows wins," the spirit of the game is dead

I invest more resources and time to get higher returns from solo CDH farming, and I don’t consider that unfair.

As for the whole “factory” argument—if running large numbers of accounts to farm event rewards (which is clearly closer to actual gold-farming behavior) hasn’t become mainstream or turned the game into a factory so far, then there’s no real reason to worry that multi-account farming for Red drops will suddenly become the norm.

 

 

3 hours ago, Chiharu said:

I understand that you feel offended and think that we're trying to get rid of you, but for the most part, we're trying to tell you what doing some shit like this would potentially and/or eventually do to our economy once others figure out that you're basically getting a pass for using it since Soma basically said that there's no evidence of you using any malicious programs. I think you're missing the whole point of what we're trying to say because you feel attacked. 

We just don't want shit to get worse because we know the community that we play in. We know that you don't care. We're just saying that if others try it too and considering that they have a track record of finding loopholes through changes because some of these people to this day still participate in RMT and still fuck up prices or take advantage of prices. If they find out that they're allowed to use the program that you use too in order to increase their chances of dropping shit and fucking up the prices even more, then the economy is even more cooked. THAT'S what we're trying to say. I don't know if you're new to C:C or not, but this have been the problem that we've been dealing with and fighting for years.

 

The part you pointed out might be due to a translation issue, or maybe I didn’t express it clearly. What I meant is: if you believe multi-account dungeon farming is a problem, then you shouldn’t fixate on VMware, because there are many ways to achieve the same thing—it’s not just VMware that leads to this outcome.

Also, it’s clear that my account is still perfectly fine right now, so it’s reasonable for me to assume that VMware is currently considered acceptable under the rules, right? So what exactly is the current demand? Isn’t the issue supposed to be that “multi-account dungeon farming harms the game environment”? Would explicitly banning VMware actually prevent that?

As for the CC community pushing for changes to the game rules, I have no objections at all—in fact, I fully support banning multi-account gameplay.

Anyway, I never really thought that the people in this discussion were trying to push me out. The only ones who gave me that impression were those two clowns I argued with on Discord before.

 

So do you understand what I’m trying to say now?

So far, I don’t think I’ve misunderstood your point. I can see that you’re worried about this continuing to be allowed, based on concerns like the economy collapsing or fairness.

All I can say is that focusing on VMware at this point no longer has any real meaning. I hope you can understand that.

 

[Xelenia]

i think at this rate there's no point to argue anymore for me, i'll just use vm then as long staff don't care and might suggest my friend to do it, if everyone don't care about economy collapse again then me neither

[KyyXD]

3 hours ago, mamekyo said:

This isn’t an ethical issue, it’s just the market not aligning with your expectations. What you call a “normal price” is simply your own definition.

What you call a “normal price” is simply your own definition.

I don't know if you don't understand what people mean by destroying the economy or what, look at the price of the item you're selling 2k bits for booster? that's only 1.4b look at how many people are offering the price so that the price of the item dropped from the raid doesn't get more destroyed, you sell the average item for 1.4 and also discounted 30%, and for fullbody some of my friends have tried their best to keep the price at 5b before you showed that you play using FMware and look now the price is destroyed because you sell it at 3b, you are really amazing, I won't be surprised in 2 weeks or a month the price of the item dropped from the raid will be the same as the drop from MH

 

[mamekyo]

3 minutes ago, KyyXD said:

What you call a “normal price” is simply your own definition.

I don't know if you don't understand what people mean by destroying the economy or what, look at the price of the item you're selling 2k bits for booster? that's only 1.4b look at how many people are offering the price so that the price of the item dropped from the raid doesn't get more destroyed, you sell the average item for 1.4 and also discounted 30%, and for fullbody some of my friends have tried their best to keep the price at 5b before you showed that you play using FMware and look now the price is destroyed because you sell it at 3b, you are really amazing, I won't be surprised in 2 weeks or a month the price of the item dropped from the raid will be the same as the drop from MH

 

Yeah, the market should just follow the prices you set so your friends can keep FB at 5B. You’re right—just keep reassuring each other with your friends. No need to talk to me.

[KyyXD]

5 minutes ago, mamekyo said:

Yeah, the market should just follow the prices you set so your friends can keep FB at 5B. You’re right—just keep reassuring each other with your friends. No need to talk to me.

The market is destroyed because the price you gave, the players will definitely look for the cheapest, and will continue to bid until the price is even more destroyed

Edited March 20 by KyyXD

[Chiharu]

1 hour ago, mamekyo said:

The part you pointed out might be due to a translation issue, or maybe I didn’t express it clearly. What I meant is: if you believe multi-account dungeon farming is a problem, then you shouldn’t fixate on VMware, because there are many ways to achieve the same thing—it’s not just VMware that leads to this outcome.

Also, it’s clear that my account is still perfectly fine right now, so it’s reasonable for me to assume that VMware is currently considered acceptable under the rules, right? So what exactly is the current demand? Isn’t the issue supposed to be that “multi-account dungeon farming harms the game environment”? Would explicitly banning VMware actually prevent that?

As for the CC community pushing for changes to the game rules, I have no objections at all—in fact, I fully support banning multi-account gameplay.

Anyway, I never really thought that the people in this discussion were trying to push me out. The only ones who gave me that impression were those two clowns I argued with on Discord before.

 

So do you understand what I’m trying to say now?

So far, I don’t think I’ve misunderstood your point. I can see that you’re worried about this continuing to be allowed, based on concerns like the economy collapsing or fairness.

All I can say is that focusing on VMware at this point no longer has any real meaning. I hope you can understand that.

 

I'm not going to ignore the VMware part. That's a done deal. But yes, I do understand what you're trying to say. Whelp, good luck on your end, this is your issue after all, not mine-

[Crossed]

To be frank the fact of the matter that they used an app/software/method with the intent to profit of it is still the overlying problem. Whether the method is in a gray area or not. Just simply saying "Ah it's not against the rules" Is pretty much just accepting this will start happening. To be blunt a ban without any of the item transactions that the person did going further into other bans is what should be done, and then further making it so that intentional exploitation in this fashion will also result in bans.

[2kilogramskebab]

@mamekyo You're doing god's work my dude, keep at it. My advice would be to ignore this thread completely for now until staff officially deems multiboxing prohibited.

From what I've seen on Discord and in this thread you're mostly being jumped at known Indonesian price fixers who don't like when they suddenly can't sell overpriced red mods or unique FB. Funnily enough, one of them literally admitted to price fixing in this very thread which is wild to me lmao. But this is of course "for the good of economy" and all that righteous stuff when in reality they suddenly lost their monopoly and feel threatened.

Do NOT get pressured by those people because they are the very cancer of this community. Continue to do your thing until you get official notice. Economy will not suddenly "collapse" because few Indos from a known Indo crew can't sell raid drops at 200% price.

Edited March 23 by 2kilogramskebab

[mamekyo]

2 hours ago, 2kilogramskebab said:

@mamekyo You're doing god's work my dude, keep at it. My advice would be to ignore this thread completely for now until staff officially deems multiboxing prohibited.

From what I've seen on Discord and in this thread you're mostly being jumped at known Indonesian price fixers who don't like when they suddenly can't sell overpriced red mods or unique FB. Funnily enough, one of them literally admitted to price fixing in this very thread which is wild to me lmao. But this is of course "for the good of economy" and all that righteous stuff when in reality they suddenly lost their monopoly and feel threatened.

Do NOT get pressured by those people because they are the very cancer of this community. Continue to do your thing until you get official notice. Economy will not suddenly "collapse" because few Indos from a known Indo crew can't sell raid drops at 200% price.

Let me clarify something: I didn’t continue selling. It’s just that Count D hasn’t been giving me any red drops, mainly because I’ve been farming a lot less. I have no reason to entertain their hypocritical moral pressure.



 

 

Also, I wasn’t sure at first whether the person who called me out on Discord, “Erlenesia,” was from the same crew. But after hearing what you said, I went to check—and turns out they actually are?

This guy just got triggered because he tried to pre-order a mod from me on 03/17 and I refused. Then two days later, he suddenly had a moral awakening and went to “general-discussions” with his guild leader to publicly call me out.

Phew, good thing I didn’t sell to you—otherwise this wonderful community would’ve lost one Indonesian hero who’s “saving the market.” Alhamdulillah!

[Icarus]

Alright, since this thread is just devolving into flaming/baiting one another, instead of a proper discussion, I'll be locking this up.